Investing in yourself is something that many people struggle with. If we invest in a training course or program, how do we know for sure that it’s going to work? The simple answer is, we don’t. We want a guarantee, but the only guarantee we really get is the one we give to ourselves.
Ramatu started a program with me after she struggled to find a job when she left grad school. She spent a year trawling through job sites, getting rejected from interviews, and even almost getting scammed, before taking the plunge of investing in herself. Despite feeling apprehensive after spending money on things that didn’t work out before, she joined my training program and ended up securing a fantastic job less than a month into the program!
Tune in this week as we learn why Ramatu invested in herself despite not having the money and why doing so paid off sooner than expected. Ramatu tells us about what she’s learned from her job searching experience and why she feels that signing up for my training program was the best career decision she made.
To celebrate the launch of the show, I’m giving away an amazing surprise gift basket filled with all my favorite things to three lucky listeners! It’ll have some headphones, some books I love and some other fun things that I know you’ll love too. Click here to learn more about the contest and how to enter.
What You’ll Learn from this Episode:
- Why you should invest in yourself.
- How to show interviewers you are employable, even if you don’t have a skill they’re looking for.
- What you should be talking about in interviews.
- How to use your existing networks to get a job faster.
- The danger of uploading your resume to job search sites.
- How to use better examples in interviews.
- Why a training program is a worthwhile investment.
Listen to the Full Episode:
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Featured on the Show:
- To celebrate the launch of the show, I’m giving away an amazing surprise gift basket filled with all my favorite things to three lucky listeners! It’ll have some headphones, some books I love and some other fun things that I know you’ll love too. Click here to learn more about the contest and how to enter.
- If you’re ready to dive deeper into your career mindset and start making a serious impact in your industry, join me at http://nataliefisher.ca/start/.
- Check out my YouTube Channel!
Full Episode Transcript:
Welcome to the Get a 6-Figure Job You Love podcast. This is episode 15: Client Success Story with Ramatu.
Hey there, welcome to the Get a 6-Figure Job You Love podcast. I’m your host Natalie Fisher. I’m a certified career mindset coach who also happens to want to skip all the BS and get to what it really takes to create real results for you in your career. On this podcast you will create real mindset shifts that will lead to big results and big changes in your career and your income. No fluff here. If you want to get a 6-figure job you love and create real concrete results in your industry and make a real impact you’re in the right place. Are you ready? Let’s go.
Hello, hello. So today we’re bringing back an old client success story that has been around for a while on the internet. I wanted to bring it to the podcast. I re-listened to it. And I have to say how impressed I am with this woman. She invested in herself even though she did not have the money. And it was based on pure belief in herself. So that is something that is so near and dear to my heart because I did the same thing and I would have never got to where I got if I hadn’t have done that.
I understand it’s difficult sometimes to take the leap. You’re like how do I know if I invest this if it’s going to work? How do I know it’s going to work? And we all want a guarantee. We want guarantees in life that everything is going to work out. And the only guarantee that we really get is the one that we give to ourselves. And we all have the power to do that. We all get the power to say, “If I make this investment and I take this step, I will make sure I get what I came for.”
And that’s one of the things that I teach my clients to do is I teach them how to get what they came for every time. And the investment that they make with me is the first one that they get to actually see what it’s like to set a goal and create it. And from then on you have now that track record of being somebody who sets goals and creates them. And it’s very difficult to do that from a space of I don’t believe I can. But the point is, is that if you don’t keep trying then you never will.
So we have to at some point have that belief in ourself. And even if we have that self-doubt, there’s still always that normal nagging brain telling us, “What if you can’t? What if it doesn’t work?” There’s always going to be that there. And you get to decide I’m going to do it anyway, I’m going to proceed anyway or stay where you are. And those are always the choices that we have. And successful people they’re not afraid to get out there and do it. They’re not afraid to fail. And maybe they are afraid but they do it anyway. Definitely know what that’s like.
So I hope you enjoy this interview with Ramatu, very brilliant lady. She’s done a lot since this interview but really great to hear where she’s come from, where she started and in just a very short amount of time what she was able to create for herself. So enjoy and I will talk to you soon. Bye.
Natalie: Well, I’m going to ask you a few questions and then if you want to add in anything as I ask you then feel free to just say whatever comes to mind. So first off I wanted to ask you, do you remember, and a lot of people don’t remember, but do you remember where you originally heard about me or discovered me on the internet, was it YouTube or [inaudible] or where did you originally hear about me?
Ramatu: It was YouTube. I actually was looking up on how to answer behavioral questions. And I happened upon your video on YouTube, it directed me, I checked the link at the bottom and saw that you have a website and where to go for additional information. And I clicked on it and it took me to your page. And you have one of those sessions where you’re sitting and listening to the how to answer a behavioral question at an interview. So I signed up for it right away.
Natalie: Okay, awesome. And so from the masterclass what was it that made you sign up for the full step-by-step program, was it something specific that I said? Or what was it that made you actually take that jump?
Ramatu: Basically when I was listening to you it was mostly to get additional information on how to answer the questions, especially the behavioral questions because they always trip me up. And also I was trying to make sure that if I do go to another interview I am prepared, not only with the behavioral questions. But what to ask the interviewers or how to tell my stories because that was the number one thing.
That was also one of the main things that I signed up for, because I felt like I had no idea on how to [inaudible] on what to do when it comes to the behavioral questions. And I had no idea how to plan it out because most of the information out there are very broad. Other stuff are just like, you know, I’ve had stuff about do the STAR method, which was what I know from my school, my graduate program or my career department here because I’ve been there a couple of times, the STAR method.
But they only have maybe one or two examples of it. And I really was looking forward to that information on how you went about answering different questions, especially when you have maybe one, or two, or three examples of that one particular question. So it kind of opened my eyes on I can do it this way, or I can do it that way. And the results, and then having your own personal, you know, trying to tie it all in together with the job.
And just to show them that you’re interested. Just to show them that you’re not just telling them some random example, so, just to see how it relates to the position and how it relates to everything that you might be doing there. So that was another reason why I signed up. Or because I don’t have much to use as an example and I was struggling really hard to find examples on writing my stories on. So I thought that was helpful. And I’m like, “I’ve got to sign up because I need all of this help that I can get.”
And then when I realized that you have all this extra stuff on it with the negotiation and all this so much information that you can just go through the videos and get. And you providing the whole data and we need to go in and how to create it, how to find people, I didn’t know anything about that. But when I heard you talk about that and when I heard about – when I actually was like, “I need to sign up and see the whole thing.” Because you had an example, a free one, I had that downloaded. But I want to have the whole access to it.
Natalie: Yeah, got you. So when you found me what kind of position were you in? You were looking for a job and what kind of results had you had so far?
Ramatu: Basically nothing. I started my job search way before December. I was graduating December 2017. I started my job search way before December, it was probably October or November-time. I was applying for jobs, but not getting any results. Because I thought well maybe it’s because they had seen my status as a student, they know that I didn’t graduate yet. So these positions they need people to graduate. So that was what I was telling myself.
And then after I graduated, I start applying – I would get interviews, and I would go in there, and they would grill me. And sometimes, I would think I did good. Sometimes, I’m just like, “Okay, I don’t think I got it, at all.” And even if I go through the second stage, they don’t even call me. And so I was stuck in interviewing or just getting a random, “You don’t qualify,” email. So I was literally just applying to jobs, after jobs, after jobs. I was just going through Indeed and all these websites and just applying.
Natalie: And how long did you do that for, several months?
Ramatu: For a long time. That’s basically what I know before I actually ran into your – I would actually go into the company’s website, fill out application. Or I would just go through Indeed. Open it up, and I’ve sent so many Indeed application, the résumé, and they just send it. I updated my LinkedIn profile. I actually go into Indeed and even the LinkedIn job site, I signed up for LinkedIn, the subscription. I applied for so many jobs through there too. But nothing, believe me, I couldn’t find anything at all because I feel like they were just screening me out.
Or if I even go for an interview I would just end up getting – a month later I would just end up getting those regular emails, “Sorry, we went with another candidate that was more qualified.” So sometimes I felt like it’s just because of the way I interview, which is why I was looking around trying to find ways for me to interview differently.
Natalie: And how was that starting to show up you when you would go to another interview, how would that affect your confidence when you?
Ramatu: I actually did an interview, actually two interviews after I did the program. The first interview was with the VA. When I went with them I took everything you said and put it into practice, or everything I’ve been practicing and putting it into action.
Natalie: So a student right here.
Ramatu: I did it. I actually, since the place was an – it was literally two – an hour 45 to two hours away. And my meeting was – I had to postpone my meeting to a later time because I wanted to make sure I was there on time. But I was there and I interviewed with two doctors and the research coordinator. They asked me a whole lot of questions that at first when they would ask me that question, questions like, “Tell me about, can you give us an example of how you handled data? Or can you give us an example of what kind of data analysis you’ve used before?”
Those types of questions I used to blank out on, because I would be like, “How do I handle data?” Yeah, but when I went through the whole practicing thing I know what to say because if I’m going into research that’s something I know I’m going to be asked about. So I usually just practice it by telling them an example of how I have handled data. Basically talking about my research project that I did, how I went in and collect my data. And after I collect it how I went in and basically starting from the beginning, I would tell them about how I – inclusion, exclusion criteria for my subject.
And then after that how I collected my data. And then when I collected it, how I decided to put it in SAS, which means I have to clean it up and create a one, two or zero scale kind of thing. Where one means yes, two means no or greater than or less than, how to calculate my…
Natalie: So you were able to tell a good story to convince them that you knew what you were talking about?
Ramatu: Yeah. I basically just told them step-by-step on how I did my stuff and how my results were. And how I think that’s going to help me be the best candidate for them because I have gone through the process. And that was just one example of many examples of some of the research that I’ve worked with, and how I analyzed my data if that’s what they’re looking for.
Because first when I was interviewing for the pharmaceutical company they would ask me something like that and usually I just blanked out. Or I would just tell them that, “Well, I did this, and this.” And I never tie it into, “Well, I know that…”
Ramatu: Yeah. Never tied the two together, I’d just leave it at like that. But it gave me more confidence to interview with them. And it just let me show them that I know what I’m talking about. It also let me – even when they asked me, one of the questions – one of the major things that they asked me about was EndNote. I had never worked with EndNote before.
But I learned from one of your videos, if you don’t know how to do it, just tell them the truth and tell them that you’re willing to learn. Don’t go about telling them that you know how to do it when you don’t. And then they hire you and then you end up having a problem with it. So I learned from what you said because that was basically what I was – I feel like that was one of the misconceptions, and one of the things that I was doing before, trying so hard to let them like me because I know how to do everything.
But when I realized that, I did that for several companies that I interviewed for even though I never did get the job with them. But when they asked me about EndNote I told them, “I have never used EndNote before. And I would love to learn more about it if they give me some training.” Because I have actually trained myself in several different stuff when I was in grad school, and I gave them the example of being a medical coder, and I was trained to be a medical coder even though I don’t have my certification. It’s my job and I was trained to code and I’ve been doing it for four years.
So from that example they know that I am someone that is teachable, so they can teach me to do EndNote. Because one of the things they required is for you to do some sort of bibliography or create some kind of reference list for the research that you’re doing. So, when they told me, “Well, EndNote is basically creating a reference list for your research.” And I was like, “Well, it’s basically like this program that I use. It’s RefME but I used RefME when I was in college, when I was writing my paper, trying to organize it. And they were like, “That’s exactly something like that.”
And so when they kind of connect the two, I understand what they were talking about when they said, “EndNote.” And I’m like, “I’ve never used it but I’m willing to learn if anyone is willing to just teach me” because I can grasp stuff really fast if they just provide me the information on how to do it. And I told them about an example.
Natalie: The example was key, yeah, because you could just go in there and say, “Well, just teach me and I’ll learn.” But you showed them, you proved to them and that’s, yeah, definitely followed instructions.
Ramatu: That is something that I know I have never done before. I’m not talking about when I go out to interview that with something that I don’t know how to do. But I would usually be like, “Yeah, I know how to do that. Yeah, I can do that.” But they don’t even like, you know, they would just brush by it.
Natalie: Yeah. And you didn’t get into the discussion that you needed to get into if you just say, “Yeah, I’ve trained at that,” or whatever and you’re not. Okay, cool. So what was the thing that caused you to spend the money on the program? Because a lot of people would say that it’s expensive. What would you say was your biggest reason for spending that money?
Ramatu: Basically, because I was just believing that if I get a job, I know I’m going to be able to pay back. In my head, I was sitting here, I was like, “If I’m going to get what I need to get a job, based on just getting that information for me to get where I’m going, I know for a fact I may not get a job, but I will be earning enough to, basically pay it back within whatever time period.
So for me, it was worth it, because I’m like, “Okay, she know what she’s talking about. She helped gotten all these people to get a job. There is no reason why I cannot be one of them. And I know for a fact if I just go on a payment plan, the minute I get a job, I’ll be able to start making enough money to pay back this whole thing because it won’t be an issue.”
Natalie: And you did.
Ramatu: So that’s basically what I told myself.
Natalie: Awesome. And so you had mentioned before when we spoke that you had also signed up for other things like LinkedIn Premium and spent your money on things that you didn’t think were worth it. And then that was another reason why you thought you could invest in this?
Ramatu: Yeah, I cancelled that. I cancelled my premium, I cancelled whatever. I just want to say I feel like I grew a lot this past year. When it comes to job search, finances and trying to be more mature about things, because one of the biggest things, I know I was stressing. I was really stressing about my job search. But I know from the beginning that if I can just find me the right position that pays me the right amount. I will be able to support myself and do what I need to do to be financially stable and be more responsible with my finances and with my life.
So basically I was just going from one place to the next looking for ways to figure out how to interview, just searching out there on the World Wide Web looking around. Just trying to get answers and I actually went to see a career coach here and she went through my résumé and she was – this was before I graduated actually. She’s like, “You’ll get a job in no time.” And I’m like, “Okay.”
Natalie: They always say that and then it’s proven a lot harder isn’t it?
Ramatu: Yeah. She looked at it. She was like, “You’re good.” And she sent me a lot of links about where I can apply for jobs and all that. And it was just one of those things, and it’s like okay, well, I took her word for it. But then after several months of going through it I was like I need a different, you know, I need something else. I even went through a Facebook group and they helped me with my résumé. I had a girl actually send me her résumé to show me what she did on hers. And so I can format mine because mine was a little bit out there.
And basically that kind of helps too, but when it comes to the interview part, I was just all over the place.
Natalie: Yeah, a résumé is a tiny part of it. They always want to help you with your résumé and then they don’t want to teach you the rest of the stuff.
Ramatu: Yeah. And I have had my husband actually say, “Maybe it’s because you talk too much.” So I’ve actually been trying to be all quiet and I’m like, this is not going to work.
Natalie: Well, you want to be yourself somewhat because you don’t want them to hire you when you can’t talk.
Ramatu: But I think he doesn’t understand that there is – but for me when it comes to – that’s the thing, I feel like when people meet me they make an assumption. And it’s really hard for me to open up and be talkative to someone unless I get to know them. And then I’m not trying to – I’m not shy around them, I can talk. But when it comes to interviews, like the first time you’re meeting someone, but I try to be more outgoing and have a firm handshake and trying to get to know them.
By the way I took your advice on complimenting them and everything during the interview, because this lady had the same shirt that I have on.
Ramatu: And I was like, “I have the same blouse.”
Natalie: Perfect, that was a great opportunity. And it’s just subconscious commonality too. She’s like, “She likes the same clothes as me.”
Ramatu: Yeah. And it was really great because that was my VA interview when I actually drove through the rain to get there that morning. And they knew that I was coming from a different city, so they knew that. So when I went in there we just talk about the weather and just they talk about their study. And I’m complimenting her on her shirt and she was a doctor there. She was really nice. They were really nice.
They tried – the thing is they tried to get me to talk to them about – they tried to get me to go in to talk to them about the actual study, which will probably be them trying to offer me the job. But I already made the decision to go with another company. Remember when I talked to you last, they sent me an email about that? So it was really great talking to them.
And another thing that I learned from you is you know how you send a thank you note afterwards? I do that. I used to do that a lot trying to get, you know, because that’s common, everyone knows. So I used to do that, even sending it, trying to find people’s email address, even if I skip them.
So at this particular interview the person that was in charge of the whole department and the program was doing some kind of summary for that meeting or something. She was doing some kind of summary. So he wasn’t able to make it to the meeting. But he was the head of the whole program at VA. So I took it upon myself to send him an email to thank him anyway. I know he wasn’t there but they mentioned him and they said, “He’s supposed to be here but he had something else going on so he’s actually working on that.”
So I was like, “Okay.” But I sent him an email and tell him, “Thank you.” I know he wasn’t, you know, I know he was going to be at my interview. And they mentioned it.
Natalie: Perfect. Perfect.
Ramatu: So I sent him a thank-you note so he can know. I was like, “I know you didn’t get to meet me face-to-face but I just want to say thank you anyway for giving me the opportunity to interview with you guys for this position. I understand you were very busy that morning and you didn’t get to make it for my interview.” But yeah, just so he can know who I am.
Natalie: Yeah. I think it was a good move. So you signed up just two months ago actually. I checked and you just – you signed up November 11th, so it took you less than a month to get your job. You’ve already started, you’re already training, because it’s not even December 11th yet.
Ramatu: I know, no, not yet.
Natalie: So how many months was it before that? Because you said it was last November that you graduated in 2017.
Ramatu: Last December.
Natalie: Okay. So you were job searching for almost a year, a full year, does that sound right?
Ramatu: Yes. Actually I’ve been searching for almost a year. Actually, I’ve been searching for a year because I was searching for jobs, hoping that once I graduate I would just start. But that wasn’t the case. So I really was searching for a year.
Natalie: And then after starting the program literally less than a month you’re already in your new role?
Ramatu: Yeah. I took all your advice. And the major thing that I think – I think there were a lot of major things. One of the main things that helps when I started your whole course, when I saw your video, when you were talking about you have to create your own opportunity. And I realized that I didn’t have a lot of network. And I understand exactly where you’re coming from when you were talking about, “You need to create your opportunity. You need to try and see – get in touch with people that you know that would probably help you out a lot.”
And I started realizing that I know a lot of people in my industry, in the field that I want to go do. Because I was in grad school and I technically got paid for to travel from these people a whole lot. But I never give thought about, hey, I’m graduating, they might be the best people to reach out to since I’m looking for a job.
Natalie: Of course, they’re all in the same industry, right?
Ramatu: If I were to reach out, I just realized this, while I was roaming around the internet looking for jobs, or while I was actually in school who are looking for jobs, to these pharmaceutical companies and these crazy people, [inaudible], all these people out there. I actually have a lot of connection where I was because I was getting paid to travel to conferences.
I literally could have just sent an email to the manager who actually was sitting right beside me when I was gathering my data. And be like, “Hey, if you guys have a position there’s me right here. I need one.” But no, I was just thinking I’m just big for my breeches, I can fly away, because I could have gotten a job literally the following – either January or April, or a couple of months ago, no, not a month ago. Well, yeah, the beginning of the year after I graduate, if I would have just reached out. Because they did offer me – the hiring manager there, that’s why you don’t look – I don’t know how to say it, kept tossing them out.
Natalie: Yeah, that’s how you say it, yeah.
Ramatu: Yeah, a position. But it was a temporary position. If I would have accepted that position and started working for them right after I graduate, I would have been working for them almost two years now.
Natalie: And you thought you could get something better so you passed it up.
Ramatu: And I thought I could do better. And then on top of that if I would have talked to her, because I didn’t know at all she was the manager at this particular clinic. She is the research manager. If I would have talked to her and be like, “Hey, I need a full-time job after I graduate, if anything open, can you please reach out?” Or if I’d have just sent her an email, or if I would just talk to the provider that was her boss that was sponsoring me, that’s what I said…
Natalie: You didn’t know what you didn’t know, right?
Ramatu: I didn’t know that I have connections and network that I could have tapped before I graduate or right after I graduate to get my job. They hired someone in April.
Natalie: So would you say that the best connections are the people who you were in grad school with?
Ramatu: Yes, they are the best connections because they know you. They know your work ethic. They’re more willing to give you a job than some stranger. And that’s what happened in my case because I feel like – not only that, I have a girl that I used to work with, I told you about her. She sent my résumé to her hiring manager and talked to them about me, and got me an interview with them at their pharmaceutical company.
The only issue is – remember when I told you, the only problem is I think it’s because they probably didn’t have – because first I thought it was me. But when I talked to you because I was having a really bad…
Natalie: That was the one that they were all confused about and you didn’t know what to talk about.
Ramatu: Yeah. But I guess they didn’t have a position that was open, but they were willing to interview me. Yeah, that’s basically what happened. But the thing is, if you reach out to people you know there is a chance someone knows someone out there that might be able to help you out. Or you might not know that the person you’re talking to might be a manager, in my case.
Ramatu: But probably just wait till something happened and/or a position come available in their unit or somewhere else. And just send you an email and get you in there for an interview. That’s what happened in my case. They hired someone in April for the position I am working in right now. The person was a transfer from another department but the position opened and she just got hired. The only thing is I wish I would have known.
Natalie: Well, we all have moments where we wish we had known something and could have gone back and done it differently, right?
Natalie: So it’s all good though, at least you’ve learned now, right?
Ramatu: I learned my lesson.
Natalie: You won’t make the mistake again. So just a few more questions I’ve got for you. So looking back at what you’ve been able to do now, what you’ve been able to achieve after you signed up for the program. Would you say that it was worth it?
Ramatu: It was because financially I’m stable. I can depend on whatever amount I’m making right now. I have good health insurance even after they take it out of my paycheck and all of that. I still have more money left than I was making in the past. I actually sent my friend a text message and was like, “This is great. I didn’t even have anything taken out of my paycheck and I was making literally 888 each paycheck.”
Right now, with over, I think four or five hundred or more taken out of my paycheck I’m still making more than my regular biweekly paycheck from my previous job.
Natalie: Crazy. So you’ve doubled, tripled, yeah.
Ramatu: Yes. It was worth it. And I’m like, “There’s no reason why I felt like…” If I would have done it all over again I wish I would have found your program first and just realized that there are ways to get people to notice you. And for people to help you out there and it’s called your network or people that you know to tap into. So you can get there faster, and be at the top of your list, because I feel like I was at the bottom of the barrel with everything else that was going on.
Natalie: Yeah, you’re not alone on that one, you’re not alone. So what would you advise people who are unsure about signing up for the program?
Ramatu: I feel like if you care about your – if you’re really spending that much time going out there, filling that application and you’re getting frustrated, wasting your money. You might as well just put it towards something that might help you. With having everyone else saying the same thing is always one thing that you’re not doing that you don’t know that someone out there knows.
So if you’re spending all your money doing all this stuff and wasting time, why don’t you spend that time going through a course – your time and money going through a course that might guarantee you a really solid job. And you don’t have to worry about paying for the program. You don’t have to worry about all of that because in the long run you’re going to be making more than you – actually you’re probably going to be making more than where you are anyway in the beginning.
Because if you’re actually starting to look for a job and thinking you need something better, there is one way to do it, just sign up, follow the instruction and do your homework, because that’s the best thing. If you just sign up and don’t do your part you’re not going to get any result. One thing that you need to do is try to gather all that information on who is in your network. I feel like you’re basically investing in yourself because you’re investing in your own job and yourself. Because once you sign up you get the information you need, you follow the course.
Your chances of getting a job is really high than someone who is out there day and night going through the website and submitting applications and waiting for them to call back, or sending emails and no one even talking to you. But if you send it to the right people, there is a chance you might get some response back. Because with all that experience what are you going to do, just keep doing what you’re doing? If it’s not going anyway, I was hoping – I was praying, I’m like, “God, please don’t make me go into year two not having a job.”
But after I find you I was like, “You know what? I’m just going to invest in it because I’ve been wasting money on these little things, like subscribing to LinkedIn, getting my application logging into – putting into Indeed.” All of those things are just a waste of time because there are other people there like you said, doing the same thing. So why don’t you just take a different route? Yes, it costs a little bit more, but like I said before, it’s your investment. It’s your money. It’s your investment. You just need to think about it as you’re investing in your life.
You’re investing in your future because when you get that job it’s going to pay you more than what you’re actually paying in to be in this actual program. And you probably won’t worry about it because before you know it, you’ll be making enough to pay it off. And you’re like, “Okay, I’m good.” And you can keep the program forever and get back in there if you need to change that job to a higher paying job.
Natalie: You can, it’s totally true.
Ramatu: Yeah, it’s your investment, it’s your life. And if I were them, I would just make – I would not change for no one. I wish I would have found you sooner.
Natalie: Thank you. I wish you had too. But I’m glad you did. I’m glad you did.
Ramatu: I actually got – weird story, I think this is because I put my information on Indeed. You know when you upload your thing and say employer find you?
Ramatu: That is one dangerous thing that people can do. I actually got a guy contacted me and saying he had a job for me. He interviewed me through Hangout on Google. And I should have known because he was typing, he wasn’t like…
Natalie: It wasn’t like a video chat or anything?
Ramatu: No, it wasn’t video chat. It was actually a fun call on Hangout.
Natalie: Okay. Interesting.
Ramatu: But I should have known, because he told me he was someone and I went in to research the company and I find out that – and I was thinking, yeah, he probably is this person. He was impersonating someone from the company saying he’s that person. So the reason why I find out that I was actually getting scammed was when he said, “Well, you’re going to have to,” because it was supposed to be one of those remote clinical data collection thing. And I was like this is awesome. I already do remote work and all that.
So when he started talking about, “Well, for you to get your computer and all this, you’re going to have to send money to me.”
Natalie: Red flag, red flag.
Ramatu: And I’m like, “Excuse me, I’m not supposed to pay so I can work for someone, they are supposed to pay me. If anything, you’re supposed to pay me or send me those stuff.” So I was like, “You know what? Something is not right.”
So I called the HR people in that particular company and I talked to one of the – lady in charge of hiring and she said, “That’s not how we do our hiring process here. And on top of that, we don’t ask people to give money or to send money anywhere. And we don’t go through that process at all when it comes to hiring, we actually interview face-to-face. And we do two or three interviews. Even if we interview through the phone we always do video interviews. We don’t do voice or text or anything like that.” So she told me that that’s not their process.
Natalie: Wow. I’ve heard of a lot of scams before but I hadn’t heard about that. That’s crazy. Wow.
Ramatu: Yeah. He was impersonating a manager at their company.
Natalie: Wow. So that’s a good tip for people is just to not put your résumé on Indeed because then you’re just susceptible to scams.
Ramatu: Yeah. I don’t know where he got my résumé but I think it was from Indeed. And he just said he came across my résumé. But I was like I only posted on Indeed and the only people that’s seen my stuff on LinkedIn is the people that are in my group. I don’t post my résumé on…
Natalie: Connections, yeah.
Ramatu: I have a profile there but I do have some information on LinkedIn. But to be honest LinkedIn, the only people I have there are people that I know from school, and professors, and people that I connect with that, you know, but second, but I don’t have that many third. So I’m sitting here, I’m like where do you get it? Either Indeed, Monster or some other website, but Indeed was the one that I uploaded with all my information. And I selected that they can actually contact me or email me if they have a position open or available.
So I went back and deleted all that after – I went back and deleted and tried to turn my information off there. But yeah, I almost got scammed but I’m not a naïve person.
Natalie: No. You’re smart. You’re smart. But someone else might have fallen for it, you never know.
Ramatu: I work hard for my money. I’ve seen a lot of American greed to know and you’re going to scam.
Natalie: Well, there is people falling for these scams every day which is [inaudible].
Ramatu: I know, I am surprised. I’m surprised, Natalie, I’m like, “How do you not know you’re getting scammed, you’re sending money to someone. You’re not getting anything back.”
Natalie: Whenever someone asks you for money you’re like, “Okay, what’s going on?”
Ramatu: Lie. That’s exactly what – once he said, “Send money,” and he said, “Western Union.” I’m like, “I have never sent money to my grandma who lives in Africa through Western Union. And you think I’m going to send money to you in the middle of nowhere through Western Union.”
Natalie: Say bye to that money.
Ramatu: No. It’s like, “You just go to – we need to send the money to our financial lady to put in an order for you. You go to Western Union at Wal-Mart, you fill out the form.” And I went – he sent me the address. So I went online to look at the address. It was in the middle of nowhere. And I’m like, “Yeah. No, I’m not doing this.”
And when I came back with the – because I got an email from the lady and everything and after I talked to the actual company and I was like, I sent him an email on Hangout and I was like, “Hey, I know you’re trying to scam me, I’m not that naïve. I might be desperate for a job but go find someone else because I know you’re not a real hiring manager.”
Natalie: That’s awesome. That’s awesome.
Ramatu: So after I sent that message he didn’t answer me at all and the account was gone.
Natalie: That’s what happens. That’s funny. Well, good for you for not falling for it and for warning people.
Ramatu: Those are all my trials and tribulation of finding a job.
Natalie: That’s a good one. That’s a good one. Thanks for sharing that one with me. I got a kick out of that one.
Ramatu: No problem.
Natalie: So I have one last question, well, actually two. Was the program easy to follow, easy to implement? Did you have any troubles there? Any feedback you want to give on the structure or the layout?
Ramatu: You really give good examples on how to do stuff. I really didn’t know how to collect people’s email address, even if they’re not on, even when you don’t know them but you know their first and last name or something like that. You can look at them on LinkedIn. But yeah, it was really easy to follow, and getting all the information you need. I didn’t know the website name. I can’t get it off my head but where you can find emails. I didn’t know about that too.
And I was talking to one of my friends and she was like, “What?” When I emailed that girl from the pharmaceutical company she was like, “How did you get my office email? It’s not even on LinkedIn.”
Natalie: There are ways.
Ramatu: I know. So yeah, I was like, “Yeah, there is this new thing that I was using. But I know it’s not on LinkedIn.”
Natalie: I just guessed. I just guessed.
Ramatu: Yeah. But I completely understand what you’re saying though, it’s kind of easy for you if someone is working for a particular company, there is basically some sort of .edu or .something or .com that they use, or how the email is formatted. But I didn’t know that there is a way to get that particular information. So it’s pretty easy for someone to follow. And I like that you give a sample, you gave us the data, the Excel sheets where you collect all your information.
I think that was pretty helpful too, because when I thought of, okay, I thought of several people that are in my eNetwork. I started making a list of their names. And then I put in their phone number and then I go through the list, the website to see if I can get their emails or work email or anything that I can get. So I will be able to contact them. And if I already have that email I’m just going to put it in there. So when I finally sat down and sent a couple of emails out to these people like, “Hey, I’m looking for a job. This is Ramatu; remember me from blah, blah, blah?”
Yeah, so basically I just go through it and try to get that. It was pretty easy to follow. I think the program itself is very, very – it’s very knowledgeable and it’s full of information that anyone can use. And I understand some people might just skip over some stuff.
For me, I actually didn’t go through the whole negotiation thing, even though I watched a video but I didn’t go through the whole, you know, the sample information on creating an actual, you know, how to step-by-step thing. Because I feel like I would have – if I would have gone to negotiation thing I definitely would sit down and put down word-for-word what I was going to say.
Natalie: But you didn’t need to because you got an offer that was good, yeah, you got a good amount, yeah.
Ramatu: And you have tons of information. And I didn’t use the résumé, I knew it was an additional thing. I didn’t use the résumé stuff in there. I didn’t use the cover letter too.
Natalie: Well, those are things important to me. I think that they are important, but they’re just a small piece of the puzzle. And if you had already done a lot of work on them before then your résumé and cover letter were probably already in good shape, so yeah.
Ramatu: I think basically it covers a lot and people can get a lot for their money. To be honest you’re looking for a job, something that if you’re me you’ll probably spend a whole lot of months struggling to look for and to find. And why not just give it a try and just pay for it? And the best option was when I saw the whole amounts, you pay this much for just one payment. I’m like, “I don’t have that in my bank account.” But then I was like, “Wait, she has a payment plan. Okay, I can do this.”
Natalie: Yeah. That’s what, I wanted to ask you about that too because that was a real stretch for you to do that.
Ramatu: It was.
Natalie: And you didn’t have that much money in your bank. So, can you speak around what you were feeling when you made that move, were you scared?
Ramatu: I was scared because I felt like I’ve signed up for a whole lot of stuff before that didn’t really pan out. And I had to pay for it either way. But for some reason, like I said before, when I started the whole program I just decided to just go for it because there is stuff that you talked about that I really do need. And I really need to see how you work through them and how you can explain stuff, how you can build your own story, how to tie it into an actual interview. And I need those. And I need to learn more about it.
And YouTube and all that, it’s great, but they don’t give you many examples. And half the time everyone is doing their own thing so you’re not very consistent if you watch one video here and then you watch another video there. That one is telling you A and this one is telling you Z. And you’re going there and you try to talk about it. And you basically are going to either confuse them or you don’t know what you’re talking about or how you’re supposed to go through things.
But if you go with the program you already know what you’re going to do and how you’re going to do it. And how you’re going to go through the next step and what you’re going to say, practice, and how you’re going to answer questions, and if you don’t know what you’re supposed to do. So it kind of helps a lot. I just feel like it’s just an investment in your life because when you get a job that’s something that you’re basically there eight out of – basically eight hours a day. It’s basically your second home. And you’re getting paid to be there.
So you want something that feels like you’re getting compensated, you’re getting with that as a person, you like what you’re doing. And to find that type of thing it’s not that easy. So you’re not wasting your money. You’re basically getting something in return which is probably better for you and probably better for your whole family. Because you don’t know, maybe that might be the thing that helps your whole family.
So for me it was something that helps me and it’s something that helps my husband too. Because now that I have a job that I can help him financially, I can breathe easy and know that he’s not taking on the burden of trying to cover everything like before.
Natalie: That’s huge. That’s huge.
Ramatu: Yeah. So it’s a huge thing. It’s a huge decision, but people should know you’re not making it just because – you’re not paying for anything. You’re paying to get something in return. And that is a good job if you follow the program to a tee.
Natalie: Thank you so much.
Ramatu: Because some people slack up.
Natalie: Yes. You have to do the work and that’s what you’ve really been a shining example of, which is why I wanted to do this interview with you, because you really did. You followed everything, you got the exact result. It was all exactly how it was supposed to be, in less time than I promise people. So, I’m like, “If you do the work you’ll get a job in a month.” And you did it in less than a month. You’ve already started and you’re already training so I can’t say how happy I am and how proud I am of you.
Ramatu: I keep saying, I feel like I was in the dark until you open your mouth and say, “Your network.” And I’m like, “What the heck. Come on, you’re struggling here. You should have done this a long time ago, remember?” And then the minute I started reaching out, the minute I started getting response. And I was like, “Whoa, this actually does work.” And then I went in and did my interview and did what I – because I went through the whole question thing.
Usually when – you know how you have the little session on the first section on what to say when they ask you about yourself?
Ramatu: Yeah. Well, I’ve been to several interviews before I find out that you’re not supposed to be talking about your whole life. Because I know in general you’re supposed to, you know, I don’t even know what to say about that. Because I never know anything about what to say when they ask you that question. But when I saw your video I was like, “Oh. So I just need to talk about my academics and my job and not my whole life story.”
Natalie: And everybody, like you said, everybody on YouTube is going to tell you to say something different.
Ramatu: That’s exactly [inaudible].
Natalie: And do you know what? It’s like they’re not all bad answers. But you have to find what works for you.
Ramatu: Yeah. It’s not that bad. Yeah, but I understand what you mean. I was just picking up stuff from one video to the next.
Natalie: Yeah. It can get confusing with all the information out there.
Ramatu: It does get confusing. And I feel like that’s why when I was starting my job search with no one to help me out, and without any direction, I would go in there and do so, you know. And thought I did really great because I’d talk about my life, I’d talk about this and talk about that. But to be honest I never did say anything about what they were looking for or how like who they want, like how to make them, I like your study, or like this, or like that. I know you guys are doing this.
I never knew that because I just thought, okay, it’s an interview; I know they want to know more about me so I’m just going to go ahead and just talk about myself. But I never did like, yeah, I never did talk…
Natalie: That’s what most people do, yeah.
Ramatu: I never did think about you need to actually like I know that you’re supposed to do research on the company. But that’s basically – for me that’s basically just common knowledge on I’m going to interview for this company and I’m doing this job. Let me see like, you know, generally, this is not so. But I don’t think about going in there and be like, “Well, actually I like that you guys are working on this because I’ve actually worked on blah, blah, blah. I know we can tie it on with this and this.”
But yeah, I learned that afterward. And I’m like why – it’s like I just have an awakening, it was like, “Come on, I need to write that down because I know that they are doing this and I can be able to do that.”
Natalie: Yeah. You used all of that stuff. It’s not just that you learned it though; it’s that you applied the knowledge.
Ramatu: I applied it, yeah.
Natalie: You learn all of it and then not use it and it would not give you the results.
Ramatu: Yeah, that’s exactly, that’s the difference because I feel like before I was interviewing, but I wasn’t applying anything. I wasn’t doing anything. I was just interviewing from one place to the next doing the same thing. But then when I realized all of that, I’m like, “Oh, I can actually tell them about this. They might be interested in knowing more about me if I tie this or this to my stuff.” And they need to know that I’m not just a number and I’m not just one of those people coming in here talking about themself.
But I learned a lot from your videos. I learned a lot from, yeah, and doing it, it’s kind of like homework but then again you just have to put a couple of hours in. You don’t need to spend a whole day.
Natalie: You went to college, you’re good at homework.
Ramatu: I know. It’s like you’re good at assignments and homework and stuff. But basically, if you’re doing it anyway you might as well just – if you’re in school and you’re doing assignments anyway and you’re like, “I need to start looking for jobs.” And they come up on your stubs like, “Well, I have too much homework, plus I have to pay for this.”
To be honest you want to graduate and get a job. You don’t want to graduate and go home and still looking for a job. You might as well just spend whatever financially, money is coming in and put it on a payment plan and just get the knowledge you’re getting from school and more. And apply for jobs and do the assignments with your assignments.
Natalie: Good advice. Good advice.
Ramatu: Yeah. But it’s just something I feel everyone should be doing because not a lot of people know about it, about trying to – there is a lot of little stuff that people don’t know about. I feel like I was so oblivious, so like so many things. And I’m like, “I’m smart, I know how to do this. I’ve got this. I will teach myself how to interview and all that.” But when you’re not an expert in that field you just need to like, you know, that’s why everyone goes to school.
Ramatu: [inaudible] to school. You’re paying to get knowledge, but this is actually worth it because it’s your job. It’s money that you’re going to be getting, either way, you’re investing in something a lot bigger and you might not even notice it once you get that job. You’re like, “Yeah, I got this job, I just need to pay that off, and pay this off, and pay this off.” I was like, “Wait, Natalie, your program.”
Natalie: Thank you. Thank you so much.
Ramatu: But that’s what I was thinking, no problem. It’s been really great. I love my job. And they love me.
Natalie: Well, who wouldn’t love you? You’re wonderful. I really [inaudible].
Ramatu: And I never knew that my boss, that this lady will be my boss until like, you know, I didn’t even know she was a manager. It really surprises me until I send an email to one of the girls and she was covering for her that week, she was on vacation. She was like, “Susan is our hiring manager, you should send her your résumé.” And I’m like, “Oh, you mean Susan, the one that just emailed me about the position? Oh, the lady I just worked with last year when I was collecting data.”
She was literally sitting on the other cubicle and I was sitting in the other cubicle. And we talked the whole time but I never did – I thought she was just a nurse. But she was the hiring manager for the whole unit.
Natalie: Yeah. You never know who you’re talking to.
Ramatu: You never know. And then she, yeah, you never know. She said, she did offer me a position. She was like, “Hey, there is this position in this unit. It’s a temporary position, if you want it, I know you’re graduating.” And I was like, “Yeah, I’m actually – I have a full-time job. And I will be going back to Raleigh,” and blah, blah, blah. “I don’t know.” And I never did apply. And I was like shoot, if I would have just gone in and look at what she was referring to I would be like, you know, because this position, sometimes you will go from part-time.
But if you’re working with them you already have – what do you call it? You already are established with them and you can apply within the department and get a full-time position and move up. For some of the girls that I actually – there is a girl that I graduated with, she started working there before me. And she actually got hired for that position.
Natalie: I think you told me about this one last time we talked, yeah.
Ramatu: Yeah, she got hired, yeah.
Natalie: Crazy. Alright, well, I appreciate so much the interview, it’s been a great interview. Thank you so much.
To celebrate the launch of the show I’m going to be giving away an amazing surprise gift basket with all my favorite things in it. It will have some headphones, some books that I love and some other fun things that I know you will love too. And I’m going to go all out on this one. So you’ll want to get in on this.
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Thank you so much for listening. I look forward to talking to you next week. Bye.
Thanks for listening to this episode of Get a 6-Figure Job You Love the podcast. If you’re ready to dive deeper into your career mindset and start creating bigger, more impactful results in your career join me at www.nataliefisher.ca/getstarted. I’ll see you over there.
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